Baystate Jeepers

So my jeep has a bad lifter. It ticks bad at startup, gets a bit better once the engine is warm, but never goes away completely. I had a mechanic look at it, and he says i have some time until it's worrisome. my options are:

#1: fix it myself. i've heard it's a bit of work, but i honestly just don't know. i don't think the parts cost very much, but the labor will be significant.

#2: try to get it fixed under warranty. i have ~2k miles and 4 months until the powertrain warranty goes away. best case they look at it, decides it is covered under warranty, and it costs me a $100 deductible. worst case, they charge me $115/hr diagnostic charge, and then even if it's covered whatever extra labor cost due to all the crap i have under the hood.

opinions?

With all the extra stuff under YOUR hood, you'd probably be best off fixing it yourself. The down side of replacing a lifter is that you need to pull the head to get to it. I'd start by just taking the valve cover off and seeing if you're lucky enough to just have a loose/worn rocker.

Either that or start using a 20w/40 motor oil

it's funny you mention 20W-40. i added marvels and it certainly helped. also, once it's warmed up just a little bit if i rev the engine for 5 seconds the tick goes away, i assume because i'm splashing/spraying oil everywhere. otherwise it takes all the way until 210 for the tick to lessen.

You could have a wrenchfest and run it a little while with the cover off while a few of people listen and look --- It'll make an oily mess though. I'm not up to much this weekend if you want help.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSsrXIVDdLI

Or, build a stroker!

Tony

What viscosity oil and what model filter are you using?

I recommend plumbing in (I used a 1/8" T) a real gauge and read your oil pressure at idle and 1600 RPM.

There is a product I have used (not in this application) that works well for cleaning engines called Auto RX.
http://www.auto-rx.com/ It works well and is effective on seal seepage too.

Take it in for a diagnostic and see what they think. Ultimately, if it is a bad lifter, it isn't too bad of a job in a TJ. XJ's are a little tighter to access. All in all it would take a decent day to do.

del_TJ wrote:
Or, build a stroker!

Tony

I'm liking this idea!!!

Next time you change the oil, instead of 6 quarts add 5 1/2 of regular motor oil, 1/2 quart of Marvel Mystery Oil. It will quiet down, and stay quiet. (x50,000 miles on my YJ motor, still quiet)

Good tip

DDewar53 wrote:Next time you change the oil, instead of 6 quarts add 5 1/2 of regular motor oil, 1/2 quart of Marvel Mystery Oil. It will quiet down, and stay quiet. (x50,000 miles on my YJ motor, still quiet)

I too am a Marvel Mystery Oil (MMO) user. I usually replace 1 full quart with MMO in Michaela's Cherokee in winter.

Also, MMO is highly regarded on a motor oil forum I'm on (Bob Is The Oil Guy: aka BITOG).

ZAEDOCK wrote:

DDewar53 wrote:Next time you change the oil, instead of 6 quarts add 5 1/2 of regular motor oil, 1/2 quart of Marvel Mystery Oil. It will quiet down, and stay quiet. (x50,000 miles on my YJ motor, still quiet)

I too am a Marvel Mystery Oil (MMO) user. I usually replace 1 full quart with MMO in Michaela's Cherokee in winter.

Also, MMO is highly regarded on a motor oil forum I'm on (Bob Is The Oil Guy: aka BITOG).

Time for me to change my Jeep's oil and filter in the next couple of days - have the new oil and filter waiting in the wings from Awful Zone. Could I add this MMO "just because" or would it be a waste of $$ unless I have an issue as outlined above? BTW she's a '97 and just turned 129K on the odometer. Thanks!

thanks for all the responses.

i am running 10W-30 dino oil and a K&N oil filter. I've been pretty good about changing it every ~3k miles.

i added MMO the last oil change and it seemed to help somewhat.

oil pressure seems fine according to the dash gauge, but i could certainly plumb one in as suggested

the engine does seems to have a rear main seal leak, but i'm pretty good about checking the level and topping it of. the auto-rx may buy me some time.

i could take it in to get diagnosed, but if i don't have them do the work there's $115+ down the drain. and i honestly trust you guys more then some pimply-faced 16 year old who just grease on his hands for the first time yesterday.

Baseshakers wrote:thanks for all the responses.

i am running 10W-30 dino oil and a K&N oil filter. I've been pretty good about changing it every ~3k miles.

i added MMO the last oil change and it seemed to help somewhat.

oil pressure seems fine according to the dash gauge, but i could certainly plumb one in as suggested

the engine does seems to have a rear main seal leak, but i'm pretty good about checking the level and topping it of. the auto-rx may buy me some time.

i could take it in to get diagnosed, but if i don't have them do the work there's $115+ down the drain. and i honestly trust you guys more then some pimply-faced 16 year old who just grease on his hands for the first time yesterday.

Sounds like you have the oil and filter covered. These engines don't need anything more than dino for a long life. You could switch to a 5w30 for winter for slightly better cold starting, but the 10W30 is fine for our area.

The dash gauge sucks. A plumbed mechanical would give you accurate readings. Even if you only plumbed it in for diagnostic purposes. The oil pumps in 2.5/4.0/258 have a typical lifespan of 120K +/-. Obviously some go much longer. I've never been impressed with the upper oiling of stock pumps though. I had lifter tick when I had an XJ 4.0L/AW4 in my rig when I was building the 2.5/SM420. I installed a high volume pump and the tick stopped. I also installed a HV pump into my 2.5L when I did the one piece pan gasket. It was $40-$50.

I don't blame you for not wanting to bring it in. Hell, look at what the dealer did to my truck. The $115.00 would buy you a new pan gasket, HV oil pump (or even new stock replacement) and a set of lifters!

Run the MMO with your 10W30 (MMO will thin it down a bit for winter too) and if it doesn't improve by Spring, we can have a tech day. There isn't an easier engine to work on (except maybe the 2.5L).

so the tick was definitively worse this morning. coldest morning in a while, so that explains a lot. however, once it runs for a few minutes if i rev it to high rpm the tick goes away. this sounds like the poor upper engine oiling issue joe described.

can anyone recommend a good source for a reliable HV oil pump? I see a new RMS and new oil pump installation in my near future. (I've heard the RMS is cheap enough from the dealer i should go there to ensure a good fit.) overall it sounds like a pretty simple afternoon job, and hopefully i can get some more life out of the lifter by fixing the poor start up/upper oiling issue sooner rather than later.

Ryan: Other things that come into play with a noisy lifter. A weak or cracked valve spring ,A worn lobe on the cam, the bottom of the lifter gouged , (wear,lack of oil ) If your going to pull the valve cover and maybe head to change it, I would change all 12 at the same time. High volume pumps would be after market. Look at Mr. Gasket, or Melling pumps, some one make it for your engine. I will give ya a hand when your ready. Heated Garage or spring , which ever comes first ! FjR68

Baseshakers wrote:so the tick was definitively worse this morning. coldest morning in a while, so that explains a lot. however, once it runs for a few minutes if i rev it to high rpm the tick goes away. this sounds like the poor upper engine oiling issue joe described.

can anyone recommend a good source for a reliable HV oil pump? I see a new RMS and new oil pump installation in my near future. (I've heard the RMS is cheap enough from the dealer i should go there to ensure a good fit.) overall it sounds like a pretty simple afternoon job, and hopefully i can get some more life out of the lifter by fixing the poor start up/upper oiling issue sooner rather than later.

Melling pumps are #1. That's all I run in my Jeep engines.

I would still plumb in a mechanical gauge before swapping though, just to verify.