2012 Exhaust Extensions

[FSHJNKY]

Agreed with Voodoo on the Stabilizer.

Also is it happening when you hit a bump on one side vs the other or both? You might have mentioned it already but I missed it if you did.


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[RalphTomaccio]

A steering stabilizer will only mask an issue and does not fix death wobble.

did you check the wheel weights? To eliminate the tires you could put the spare on the side with the wobble.... do you know if they rotated the tires or if we rotated the tires when doing the lift?

I agree with what you're saying about the stabilizer.

As far as the wheel weights, no I have not checked them yet. And, no, we and they did not rotate the tires.

To me, it feels like both are going wild. But, If only one tire hits a hole that causes DW, does just that one wheel wobble or do both?

[Frank]

Rule of thumb. If it ran before you did a repair and now it wont , its something you did. If it didnt shake before , its something they did. Did you get a computer printout of the alignment ? A lot of places show you before and after printout. Most times Ralph , It turns out to be a bad ball joint , bushing or mostly the caster* degrees or lack of. Which brings us to the alignment . I would check the forums to find out what worked for other JKs. Caster is important in front end geometry. Its usually a degree of caster for every in of lift . Then fine tune. Good luck bud. FjR68

[schwalby]

Ask Mike White about steering stabilizers and death wobble, don't stand too close when you do though. As Jeff also said steering stabilizers do not cause death wobble, it is an age old wives tale. I would check the tires, again as others have said, and also check all the fasteners to the suspension components. I was having some sway issues with the JK after it was lifted and turned out some how one of the sway bar mount bolts loosened up. They were never touched during the install but sure enough they were loose and tightening them took away the excessive sway.

[RalphTomaccio]

Okay, guys. Here are screen shots of the alignment specs as of this morning. Any info you can offer is very much welcomed, especially if you can tell me where they should be with the lift as it sits today.

[RalphTomaccio]

Dremel bit 9903 will do it.
It's made of Tungsten Carbide. It'll even cut thru hardened tool steel like E-Z outs.
Ask me how I know..

Thanks, Kurt.

I went to True Value and picked one up. They are close, so I thought I would save time that could be used working on the Jeep. Well, I wore that one out and checked with Lowe's and they had it. Went to get it, came back home, chuck it into the Dremel, get under the Jeep, turn it on, touch it to the bolt head protector and, within 1 second, the bit breaks! What luck. I'm too darn frustrated to continue tonight. I'll try picking another up on the way home from the meeting tomorrow.

A pleasant surprise provided by Dremel Customer Service. I emailed them my experience with the breakage and they sent me two to replace it. Nice to run across a company that understands good customer service!

Still researching the Death Wobble issue. It's beginning to point to possibly being ball joints. I'm bringing it in to have it looked at by a "Master Mechanic" to get his opinion on Monday. Surprised there were no comments after posting the alignment specs.

[RalphTomaccio]

Brought the JKU back to Firestone to have their master mechanic take a look at the complete steering and suspension this morning. He couldn't find anything loose or bad, but did say he suspects the upper control arms may need replacing. Ball joints are good. While there, I had them balance all the wheels as I don't believe that has been done in a while. Will it make a differences? I'll find out when I have a chance to get on a highway and hit a few bumps.

Stay tuned!

P.S. I called Tom Woods today and ordered the new front driveshaft. They said it will ship out tomorrow and should have it in five days.

[Frank]

Did he say why the upper arms needed to be changed ? Most of the time when a lift is done it requires at least one set to be adjustable for alignment purpose . As for the post of the spec , is the first one before or after , and the second is the spec chart they use from Jeep ? All it tells me is the right front tire had a lot of toe in and the caster seamed to be well into spec with each other and overall. The camber totals will only change as ball joint wear or you bend that axle. Check you steering shaft slip collar and or U-joint , pitman arm , IMO Ralph , if youve got DW , something is loose,worn, or moving. Watch a video of DW if you dont understand whats actually happening . It has to do with the front end components. Setting it to factory specs might not be the answer cause there is a lift in it. I think Ive read an degree of caster has to be added for every inch of lift. Mike had a lot of experience with this JK issue. FjR68

[RalphTomaccio]

Did he say why the upper arms needed to be changed ? Most of the time when a lift is done it requires at least one set to be adjustable for alignment purpose . As for the post of the spec , is the first one before or after , and the second is the spec chart they use from Jeep ? All it tells me is the right front tire had a lot of toe in and the caster seamed to be well into spec with each other and overall. The camber totals will only change as ball joint wear or you bend that axle. Check you steering shaft slip collar and or U-joint , pitman arm , IMO Ralph , if youve got DW , something is loose,worn, or moving. Watch a video of DW if you dont understand whats actually happening . It has to do with the front end components. Setting it to factory specs might not be the answer cause there is a lift in it. I think Ive read an degree of caster has to be added for every inch of lift. Mike had a lot of experience with this JK issue. FjR68

Hi Frank,

I'm thinking he said that he suspects the upper control arms simply because everything else looked good/new/tight and couldn't think of anything else to say. Hate to begin just throwing money at it and hope I find the right issue.

As for the photos of the alignment specs, the big one was after the alignment. I'm not sure about the smaller one as the specs shown are basically the same as on the other photo.

Is there anyplace I can find more concrete guidelines as to what the specs should be when lifting a Jeep? Firestone asked me if I had any and I had to say "no" at this point. I'll try contacting Mike and see if he can chime in on this.

[MDSRACING398]

Have you checked the hubs? Wheel bearing will cause it and is usually overlooked because not part of steering. Elias I'm sure will know alignment specs but I have no clue if they'll tell you without working on it, but may be worth call to bounce your symptoms off of and see.

[FSHJNKY]

So it didn't do it before the work recently but it does it now. So it's something to do with what was done. Not that something was done wrong but something is off, not aligned right or something. The lift may be exaggerating an existing issue but I seriously doubt that's the case. Is something too tight and not allowing something too move freely? Did you loosen and retourque the control arms and everything else to spec. Just because everything is new doesn't mean it's not faulty. Are all the jam nuts tight? Is everything greased and lubed? Can you replicate the issue on command by hitting the same bump over and over again on one side or the other or both? It doesn't happen at certain speeds or just by the tires being unbalanced so it's a bump steer issue. So something is loose or bent or off somewhere. I don't think it's a throw money at it issue as much as a where is the weak point issue? Did you add a relocation bracket for the front track bar? If so can you remove it and still use the adjustable trackbar without the bracket? Where are you located Ralph? I am more than happy to meet up with you and go through a bunch of tests to try to at lease find the issue.


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[RalphTomaccio]

Hi Paul,

Two of our most knowledgeable members, Kurt and Don, did the vast majority of the lift installation, so I know it was installed correctly. I do believe it is possible the problem existed prior to the lift and became exaggerated after the lift was installed. I have contacted and have worked with both Rock Krawler and the person I bought the lift through, Jared at Scerbfab in NH, as well as two mechanics at Firestone trying to find the source of the DW. Firestone spent two hours checking everything. When the driveshaft goes in in a few weeks, I will be again checking all the nuts and bolts. I must say though, that I went out today looking for bumps on the highway and, although a limited test, do believe the problem may have been caused by the wheels being out of balance as it handled much better. A more thorough test is needed.

A new front track bar was included in the lift kit and does not use a bracket.

I live in RI and appreciate your offer to look at it. You're in NH, correct? Another pair of eyes can be helpful but, in all honesty, considering all the people who have already looked at it, I'm not sure it would be beneficial.

[RalphTomaccio]

Have you checked the hubs? Wheel bearing will cause it and is usually overlooked because not part of steering. Elias I'm sure will know alignment specs but I have no clue if they'll tell you without working on it, but may be worth call to bounce your symptoms off of and see.

Not sure if the hubs were checked or not.

[FSHJNKY]

I have no doubt it was done correctly and far better than I would've done myself. I have no clue if I would be of any help but another set of eyes never hurts. I am hoping that the problem is solved as I hated when this was happening to me. The only other thing I have found is the tire place that I go to fills the tires to the factory recommended PSI and that is too much for my aftermarket 35's and I know immediately when they do that because the first bump I hit sends it all out of whack. Lol good luck with the problem solving. Just giving yo some ideas and things to look at.


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